Subjects: Sarah Hanson-Young; Administrative Appeals Tribunal; Commonwealth Games overstayers; Ged Kearney; Labor's border protection failures; Linda Burney's fraudulent transcript.
EO&E...........................................................................................................................................
RAY HADLEY:
Most Thursdays I speak to the Immigration, Border Protection and Home Affairs Minister Peter Dutton and he's on the line right now. Minister good morning.
PETER DUTTON:
Good morning Ray.
RAY HADLEY:
She just is a gift that keeps on giving to broadcasters.
PETER DUTTON:
Well and you're right; it's good to point out that these are the people that were in government last time with Labor and if Bill Shorten wins the election, he will be relying on these people for advice, and people wonder why Labor wrecked the economy, they let the boats start up again, it's because they've got these crazy Greens sitting right beside them. Labor has, in every seat across the country, an arrangement with the Greens of preferences and if you're voting for those people, well, I don't think you've got much of an eye on the future of this country or if you're worried about your kids and the rest of it.
RAY HADLEY:
You and I seem to talk about the Admin Appeals Tribunal every week and it usually ends by you saying: Ray, I may have to make a decision in one of these matters so it's better that I don't say anything about it.
Today The Australian documents your intervention in another shocker. This time a Palestinian man previously jailed for belonging to a terrorist group, planning to blow people up, applied to come here because he's apparently married to an Australian citizen. The AAT acknowledged the man, known as Mr Khalil, had an extensive criminal record, but disputed the Government's view he failed the character test. They thought it was more important that his child have a father in Australia than the people of Australia be protected.
Now, you've had to intervene here, and I also note and I wanted to talk to you about this, that you or the Department got rid of some left-leaning AAT members and I discover through the week, thanks to the work of other people, that the same AAT are now employing the people that you parachuted out as casuals. Is that continuing to happen?
PETER DUTTON:
Ray, obviously as I've said to you before, and I make this very serious point; we have a problem with the AAT and there's no sense pretending otherwise. The AAT does not reflect, in many of these cases, the view of the Australian people. In my judgement it's unacceptable to be appointing people who clearly don't have the confidence of the Government and clearly don't have the confidence of the Australian people.
So we are looking at ways in which we can reform, from my perspective, the migration aspect of the AAT and I want to make sure that if we cancel the visa of somebody who has committed serious criminal offences, or somebody that we know has been involved in crimes or membership of an outlaw motorcycle gang, for example, that person, as a visa holder, has their visa cancelled and they're deported from our country.
Now, I'm not going to take a backwards step on this and we are going to make sure that the AAT and the members there reflect community standards. We aren't going to allow people to stay on and to commit further crimes, for further victims to suffer at the hands of some of these people. We are talking about serious criminals. We don't want them in our country. I want them out and that's why we've cancelled more visas in the last 12 months than Labor cancelled in six years.
RAY HADLEY:
But in relation to these people that are appointed, and many of them are from the previous Labor government, we're talking about a Deputy President here, James Constance, rejected the Government's argument that the Tribunal had no jurisdiction to examine the circumstances beyond the conviction of an appellant – in this case the Israeli legal system. They also came to the conclusion the man, who had lied about his criminal record on the visa application; they decided he'd not engaged in the conduct that the Israeli Military Court had jailed him for. So they're second-guessing independent authorities in independent nations about the guilt or innocence of people trying to access our country.
PETER DUTTON:
Well Ray, there are countless examples that you can look at, and as you say, you've cited some. Keith Moor, again, has done a great job in the Herald Sun over a long period of time trying to highlight some of these anomalies.
We have a cultural problem and I want to make sure that the intent of the Government – that is, to cancel visas of non-citizens who have committed crimes against Australians – is carried out. I'm not going to have that compromised and the Parliament has voted these laws in.
The laws are powerful laws in that they can make our society a safer place. There should be judicial oversight and I'm happy with all of that. As we've discussed on many occasions before, people should have their fair day in court, but as we know – and you see it with the Commonwealth Games, people that have overstayed now – some people will be in the system for years at the cost of millions of dollars to the Australian taxpayer to deal with these matters.
We need to have, I think, a more truncated system; a better way that people can have their day in court; a decision's made and you're out; instead of this prolonged period that goes on for years at enormous cost. Over the period of that time, some cases, welfare's being paid, their legal fees are being paid. Australians are being taken for a ride and we are not going to tolerate it.
RAY HADLEY:
You see here the people being appointed don't necessarily have to have a legal background or be a lawyer. It's not like appointing a judge. You're appointing people to reflect the feelings I guess of the electorate.
But just if I can concentrate on this Commonwealth Games issue – you just raised it – with the benefit of hindsight – whether it was you or a counterpart from the other side of politics – I don't think there's too much you could do in relation to this and I think you cited, when we had a discussion a fortnight ago about this, even if it's a convention of a service organisation where people come from other parts of the world, they come here in good faith; you think they come here in good faith, but they decide they want to jack up and stay here.
There's not much you can do and I don't know what you could have done prior to the arrival of these athletes and officials and media representatives from African nations, particularly for the Commonwealth Games, what you could have done to usurp what they eventually tried to do or are doing.
PETER DUTTON:
Oh Ray look, I mean we were criticised at the time, I think Peter Beattie was criticising us for having taken too long to scrutinise some of the cases and in some cases we refused to issue visas, we looked at the bona fides of some individuals and decided that we were not going to allow them to come. There were about 13,600 visas issued first up.
So you're right; it's an annoying transaction cost of performing a Games or having an event, particularly where you've got some Commonwealth countries that are poorer nations coming here. They arrive, they go to a city like the Gold Coast and go to Sydney or Melbourne or wherever it might be and think geez, this is too good to leave. So there are many factors there that you just can't change.
There needs to be more work I think done through the Commonwealth Games Organising Committee, no doubt through the Olympic Organising Committee as well to make sure that there is a greater onus on some of these countries and the officials that are vouching for these individuals – not just athletes – but some of the managers, the trainers and media staff as well and if they're not prepared to vouch for them, or maybe put up a bond, we're going to have a look at different ways in which you can do it.
But in the end, they're difficult decisions and I'm proud of the fact that we got through the Commonwealth Games without any major incidents. We were very worried, from a security perspective, about different elements including drones and the rest of it and the police did a fantastic job.
So, none of these people, at least to date, have committed criminal offences to my knowledge. So we just need to round them up as quickly possible and enforce the law, have people abide by the law.
RAY HADLEY:
Okay. We're looking at more than 250. You said yesterday in The Australian that 190 had sought Protection visas to remain here and 15 had applied for visas of another kind – so that takes it to 205. Once they get a Protection visa, which I think you must grant automatically under international law, people would want to know what they're entitled to immediately?
PETER DUTTON:
So the 50 that's not accounted for just in those numbers; so 190 have applied, maybe a couple more now have applied for a Protection visa. So those people move on to what we call a Bridging visa, so that just allows them to be lawful here until their matter is decided on. Fifteen have applied for visas otherwise, same process for them. There are 50 or so who have gone to ground, effectively, who have disengaged and the Australian Border Force is conducting an operation at the moment to locate those people, detain them in immigration detention and then deport them.
So to go to your question in terms of what people are entitled to; people are entitled to access to the health system, so Medicare, and they're not allowed access to welfare beyond that, except in some exceptional circumstances, but the general rule is that people can't access welfare.
RAY HADLEY:
Okay. Were you in the House when Ged Kearney made her maiden speech?
PETER DUTTON:
No, no, please…
RAY HADLEY:
Well I just thought that maybe you would have had your hands under the bench, punching the air so to speak – although where you sit there's probably not a bench in front of you – but were you punching the air when you heard her say that the bipartisan asylum policy is shameful? And this is someone who would be in a position of power, if they were to form government and all of a sudden we'd have another 50,000 in a short period of time coming over the horizon.
PETER DUTTON:
Ged Kearney is another former union head. I mean she is like a goddess within the Labor Party. She's a powerful voice within the caucus and an influential person over Bill Shorten. She's basically saying get us into government and we'll unwind the policy that stopped the boats.
You've had Linda Burney now – again a senior Labor figure, an influential figure – who was on Sky News last night saying basically what Ged Kearney had said and has now doctored a transcript – in fact fabricated a transcript – not just dropped out a word or two, she's completely rewritten the interview. It's just unbelievable.
RAY HADLEY:
I saw that Kieran Gilbert this morning has pointed out that the transcript issued by her office bares little resemblance to what she said last night to David Speers.
PETER DUTTON:
Well that's a kind interpretation of it. I mean it's a fabrication and it's pretty outrageous actually. I think there will be a lot spoken about this today.
But imagine taking a morals lecture from somebody like Ged Kearney. She says oh, we need to have a more humane policy. Well actually, it was Kevin Rudd who negotiated Manus and Nauru arrangements. We didn't put people on there. We're actually the only Government that's brokered a deal with the United States to get people off and we haven't got new boat arrivals. It was actually Labor that changed the policy that John Howard had in place and 1,200 people drowned at sea. The sanctimony of these people, and yet they're prepared to undo all of the policies that we've put in place, the hard decisions we've made, Ray. If they get into government, Shorten won't contain these people.
RAY HADLEY:
Look, you'll have to apologise, I've just been passed a note from The Australian online: the office of Labor MP Linda Burney has claimed the doctoring of the transcript, in that tough interview about Labor's asylum seeker policy, was a mistake.
PETER DUTTON:
…a mistake…well, they've got a very bad typist in their office Ray.
RAY HADLEY:
Alright. Listen, before you go, you better listen to this on the way out, it's another tribute to Sarah Hanson-Young, when she thought Sea Patrol was actually not a fictional – she thought it was a real life story, Sea Patrol.
So we'll talk to you next week, thanks for your time.
PETER DUTTON:
Thank you.
[ends]
