Subjects: Labor candidates in Tasmania; Boosting water quality in Macquarie Harbour; Migration; Middle East conflict.

GREG JENNETT, HOST: Alright, we might pick up on immigration and other matters of the day with our political panel. Let's introduce them. Joining us from Sydney, Labor Member for Kingsford Smith and Assistant Immigration Minister Matt Thistlethwaite. Welcome back to Afternoon Briefing, Matt. And from Hobart beaming in is Shadow Environment Minister, Liberal Senator Jono Duniam. Jono, welcome back for you too. Why don't we start. I'll go, well, sort of indirectly to Tasmania but start with you Matt Thistlethwaite. The government getting its election house in order today. Two ALP candidates in Anne Urquhart and Rebecca White for Braddon and Lyons respectively. Now lined up some money for the seabed sand ray, the Maugean Skate as well. All systems go in the island state for Labor now, is it Matt?

MATT THISTLETHWAITE, ASSISTANT MINISTER FOR IMMIGRATION: These are two great announcements of candidates today, Greg. Bec White, former leader of the Labor Party and a strong advocate for the people of Tasmania. And Anne Urquhart who's really been the shadow member for Braddon for many, many years. I've been to Braddon on a number of occasions with Ann and you can't walk down the street without locals pulling her up and saying hello. She knows that community perfectly and they're two great candidates and this is part of our process of selecting candidates. We've been doing this for the last 12 months, getting ready for the election sometime next year.

JENNETT: Yeah, certainly got people wondering how far into next year. I won't unnecessarily be able to pin either of you down on that, but Labor's obviously eyeing off, well, at least one, if not both of these seats here. Jono Duniam, sending a shiver down the Coalition's spine in your stronghold?

JONATHON DUNIAM, SENATOR FOR TASMANIA: No, it doesn't. Obviously, Labor are taking it seriously. They have got two candidates they've announced today and, you know, there's a certain degree of profile attached to both of them. But Tasmanians aren't going to be looking at whether they know the name, they're going to be looking at the policies. And in the Tasmanian context, there are some specific areas that the Labor Party are wanting and they are, of course, giving back the $240 million of GST they've taken away from us. And also where are they at on the salmon industry? We've had a year of uncertainty and delays on whether or not that industry can continue to operate on the west coast of Tasmania. It doesn't matter what Labor candidate they have, if they can't get the policies right, people are not going to vote for them. So, we're going to keep doing the right thing and campaigning hard and we expect to win those seats.

JENNETT: All right, just to tease that out a little further with you, this Maugean Skate, the government announced some money for the protection or research of that fish, for want of a better description, today. Jono, why is that inadequate? Why not fund that while the pending decision kind of awaits on salmon fish farming?

DUNIAM: So, look, the funding for conservation efforts is of course welcome. There's nothing wrong with that. And I, like all Tasmanians, want to see the Maugean Skate survive into the future and thrive, indeed. But it does not take a year to make a decision about the future of the industry. The Minister, the department confirmed at Senate estimates last week, they have all of the information they need and the Minister now can make a decision. Indeed, I extended an invitation to the Prime Minister today. He could bring laws into Parliament next week if he really wanted to. He's got the numbers in the House. He could team up with us in the Senate and we could pass laws to overturn this silly situation, end the uncertainty back in the science and secure the jobs, 5,000 of them in this industry in perpetuity.

JENNETT: So, why, Matt Thistlethwaite, is this just being rolled over into, you know, the latter half of next year, October I believe is now the decision date?

ASSISTANT MINISTER: Well, Greg, you've got a threatened species down there in the Maugean Skate and there's scientific evidence that is related to deoxidization of the waterway down there, related to fish farming. At the same time, you've got $1 billion industry that employs a lot of Tasmanians. So, we would like to see the industry survive, but the protected species thrive once again. So, this announcement today is about having a go at trying to improve the environmental outcomes in the habitat of the Maugean Skate, but at the same time hopefully maintain the industry and those important jobs over longer term.

JENNETT: Can you have both, Jono?

DUNIAM: Absolutely, you can have both. And that's what the science is pointing to and indeed what we all want and hope for. But in order for that to happen, we can save the Skate through the efforts that are in place now and credit to the government for backing it in with the announcement today. But they've got to save the industry as well. There are 5,000 jobs attached to it and this uncertainty will kill it off if they don't make a decision soon.

JENNETT: All right, let's move on to migration. So, this one a little more firmly in your wheelhouse, Matt. After the US election, Peter Dutton and others, I think, on the Coalition front bench shining a light again on the current intake levels being run by this country. A million over two years, only 350,000 homes built, said Peter Dutton today. He also suggested this can create social tension if planning and building isn't kept up with that. Why hasn't the intake slowed down in the numbers we see already?

ASSISTANT MINISTER: Well, we are slowing the intake down. We've made announcements about that. We've now got a migration strategy, Greg, which looks at sustainable levels of migration moving forward. And we've consulted about that and we've put that plan in place. And under that plan we're reducing the level of net overseas migration. And that's evident in policies such as the caps that we're putting on international students. We're cracking down on things like visa hopping, people coming here on tourist visas and then trying to hop on to other visas. We're stopping that and we're making the levels of migration much more sustainable. But under the Coalition there was no plan. So, you had willy-nilly numbers. They got out of control. We're now trying to bring those levels down to more sustainable levels. But plan for the future, particularly making sure that employers have the skilled labour that they need to grow their businesses and grow our economy.

JENNETT: You might have visibility on these numbers being issued, Matt, but I'm not sure it has shown up in ABS data yet, has it, this forecast drop in net overseas migration?

ASSISTANT MINISTER: So, what happened was obviously pre-Covid, we had quite high levels of migration under the former government. Then Covid hit and the borders closed and the numbers dropped dramatically. So, a lot of people that weren't able to come to Australia during those Covid years. So, for instance, international students, once the borders opened again, they had visas to come to Australia and they did. So, the numbers spiked and now we're bringing those levels back down. It will take a little bit of time to filter through to ABS data, but the policies are now in place, Greg, and we've seen the commentary about the student caps, but that's the right policy because it will bring those levels of international students down to more sustainable levels and ensure that we've got the resources to meet that.

JENNETT: Yeah, that's assuming that legislation goes through the Senate in the next fortnight. Jono Duniam, yeah, just pick up on the political prosecution of migration running at levels too high. At least that's what's being asserted by Peter Dutton. But what does he mean by create social tension? What's he referring to there?

DUNIAM: Well, I think, as we heard in what the leader said, you know, you've got X number of people coming in, but not the requisite infrastructure being put in place to cope with increased numbers of people living here. Housing, health, roads, you name it. Those things that we all utilise and need obviously have greater pressure placed on them. And so it isn't their fault, it is the government's fault who are allowing numbers to come in in the order that they are, but doing nothing to cater for those extra people who are coming to our country. And, you know, much has been said about this, but it is the government's responsibility to actually provide these services, whatever they might be, be it health, as I say, or roads, and of course, most importantly, housing. That was the stat that the leader mentioned. So, this does cause tension and the government need to fix this mess. They're the ones in charge and they've got the levers to pull to be able to do so.

JENNETT: Do you acknowledge that social tension, Matt?

ASSISTANT MINISTER: Well, it's about ensuring that you've got a sustainable program and that you're putting in place the measures to manage newly arrived migrants. And that's exactly what we're doing through the migration strategies, we're bringing those levels down the more sustainable levels and ensuring that there is the infrastructure to cater for that. So, for Instance, with the student caps, you've got a solid cap and a university or an educational institution can't seek to go above that cap unless they can demonstrate that they're building additional student accommodation to house those students. So, for the first time, Greg, for the first time, you've now got a policy in place that properly manages migration to ensure that the numbers are sustainable and that you got the supporting infrastructure and the housing to manage it. That's never happened under the Coalition and has never happened before in Australia's history.

JENNETT: All right, we'll be talking to the university sector, incidentally, on the student cap bill a little later in the program. Can we move across then to international affairs now? Bob Carr, Matt, you might have heard this morning a known supporter of Palestinian recognition within the Labor movement said today the Albanese Government should recognise a Palestinian state within the remainder of this parliamentary term because he seems to fear Labor slipping into minority status after the election. Will you?

ASSISTANT MINISTER: Well, firstly, we're going to try and win the election and have a majority government. That's the first point. Palestinian statehood has been in the Labor Party platform for a number of years now, but we don't believe that it's the right time at the moment, given that the priority with the conflict should be a ceasefire, the release of hostages, the rebuilding of communities and measures to establish a long term peace. They have to be the priorities. And that's why the government's record in the United Nations, in the actions that we've taken with other nations like New Zealand and Canada has all been aimed at ensuring that we get to a ceasefire and the release of hostages as quickly as possible. That has to be the priority.

JENNETT: There's so much influx at the moment internationally, Jono Duniam, and there is this prospect of a Trump intervention of some sort. Some people call it a grand bargain involving Saudi Arabia, Egypt, perhaps Israel, of course. Might it be worthy of exploring Australia's options for recognition, you know, in case Donald Trump switches up all of the dynamics of this region?

DUNIAM: Well, I think just on that, I mean, we have to be resolute and clear in where we as a country stand on the issue. And I think what Matt said is broadly right, jumping to recognition of statehood pre-emptively before these, this conflict is resolved when we have hostages still in captivity. And the atrocities, of course, that are occurring in the way they are seems to be rewarding barbaric behaviour which just is not on at all. I mean, it was quite telling that Bob Carr said, of course, that he was worried about if the Labor government went into minority government that the crossbench would get credit for reaching what he is proposing they do, which is alarming because if it is the minority that are pushing for this to happen, that is the crossbench, that can cannot be good foreign policy at all. So, I'm alarmed by that. But look, let's see where the new Trump administration takes us. We just have to be vigilant, but we should be clear about where we stand when it comes to the Middle East conflict.

JENNETT: Yeah, well, oddly you might have a bit of agreement from Matt around what a minority government would bring to policymaking, but let's not explore that just yet. I think there'll be plenty of time to do that between now and the next election. As we discovered today, all of the preparations are in place. We'll wrap it up there. Jono Duniam and Matt Thistlethwaite, thanks to you both.

ASSISTANT MINISTER: Thanks, Greg.